Author Topic: Dwarf Units and Tactics  (Read 15997 times)

ajax98

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Dwarf Units and Tactics
« on: February 21, 2009, 11:18:41 PM »
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Dwarves of Runegard Units and Tactics

I'm using Ultiville’s Breakdown and rating method For the Dwarves. I added one more rating category to Ultiville’s and that is “Cost Efficiency”.

I'll list each Dwarven unit and give a number of stars to each general role I think one might try to use it in, from 1-5.  If I don't list a given role it means I think it can't do that, but I could always be wrong or forgetful, so please respond and post your own if you like!

We can also use this thread for Dwarven tactics and Strategies.

If you have a post you've made in another thread that you think fits in this one, feel free to post it; I think it would make some sense to have everything in one place.

General guideline to what the stars mean:

*:  It looks like this unit might be able to do this, but I've found that this is a trap.
**:  In select cases, the unit might not completely embarrass you trying to play this role.
***:  The unit plays the role competently.  Generally it won't work miracles, but it justifies its points in most games.
****:  The unit is excellent at that role.  I'll try to "upgrade" other units in that role to this one if I can.
*****:  Centaurs.

Stars are points-adjusted, so you'll often see a unit that's better on the table getting fewer stars at a role, because it isn't enough better to make the points worth it in my opinion.

Roles:

Tank: This is a unit you use to soak up hits and last long enough for relief to arrive, without planning on it doing significant damage.
Light Infantry:  This is a unit that you plan to have last just long enough to get help, and maybe do a bit of damage while it's at it.  It won't stand up to a real damage unit, but it will prevent opposing tanks from embarrassing you by pinching in.  I think of this as the "offensive" version of the tank unit.
Heavy Infantry:  The game's generalist units.  They have good attack and defense stats, but neither is enough of a standout that they aren't capable of both dealing and taking some damage.  These are the non-specialist guys who you plan to use to cover contingencies and things like that.
Light Damage:  This is a unit you use to charge in, either against weak units or into a pinch.  This plan involves breaking them on the first turn because the unit will be in trouble if you don't.
Heavy Damage:  This is a unit you use to charge in and beat people up on the charge turn, but unlike Light Damage, you trust them to last a few turns if things go wrong.
Fire Support:  This is a unit you use to add fire where it is needed.  You don't count on them to get much done on their own, but combined with a reasonable infantry unit or other fire support, they can create holes in the opposing line and get things going.
Artillery:  The big guns.  These units add fire support, but the fire is meaningful enough that you are hoping they'll do big damage over the course of the game, rather than serving a dedicated support role.
Other:  Sometimes I'll put in another category, like "Centaurs" or "Bowriders" and explain it in the comments.
Cost Efficiency: how well do their abilities match to their cost in effective use. In this rating the stars are 1 to 5 meaning 5 stars is you’re a fool if you don’t take them and 1 star meaning don’t bother buying it.


I'll also give every unit an overall score indicating how often I tend to play it.

Dwarven Unit Reviews

Antonian Horsemen
Light Damage: ****
Heavy Damage:*
Cost Efficiency: ***
Overall: **/*

Antonian Hosemen are one of the top light Cavalry Units in all the factions(IMO).  They have the Top speed for all units save Dragons, having a 7” move, which gives them the Bonus against being shot at For being a fast moving Unit. This speed also makes it possible for them to support nearly any engagement on a close defensive field. For the Dwarves, they end up Being a support Unit only. Have a good solid Core Line of Infantry and place one or two of these Units at the sides to rush in for a Pinch along your line. There Secondary purpose is to taking out Routing Units. There are few enemy Units that can escape their range during a route. So tactics for this unit should be to Never initiate an Engagement themselves, wait for another Unit to engage the Enemy Unit them Rush in from the side or Rear on the next turn for the pinch. If an Enemy unit the horsemen were engaged with routes on the enemies turn (or the Horsemen were already Unengaged), Rush in on that Units rear to finish them off. This is the only time the Horsemen should engage a Unit on its own. A routed Unit usually already has lost dice due to damage, and will lose more attack dice attacking to it’s rear, thus reducing the risk to the Horsemen’s low health.


Dwarven Axemen
Tank: ***
Heavy Infantry: ****
Heavy Damage: ***
Cost Efficiency: ****
Overall: ***/*

This is your Dwarven Infantry CORE unit, and not just because they are a “Core” unit. Nearly all the infantry of the dwarves could do well as Tanks. This is because Dwarven Infantry have the Highest health for General Infantry Units of all the factions. 12 Hit points is the standard for them all. What separates these from the rest? #1 they are a Core unit and you need to fill those Core unit Slots. #2 their attack stats are Decent at 5’s across, so they are generally going to do damage against most any other unit. #3 they have 2/3 Defense where most other Dwarven Infantry has a 1/3, so they can stand a bit longer in the fight.

Dwarven Ballista
Artillery: ****
Cost Efficiency: ***
Difficult to use:
Overall: ***

If artillery is what you need and can use it effectively, these guys will do the Job for you. My recommendation, though, is take them with prudence. The cost is High for a unit that Can’t Shoot and Move and you could get a better melee Unit or 2 Pawn units for the same price. This Unit has the Best Range of all Artillery units and has a decent Overkill chance on the damage. If you can shoot it This is going to do some heavy damage. But there is your Problem, “IF you can shoot it”. Three reasons to Take this Unit? #1 Large to Colossal Units are in the enemy ranks. Why? Because then your going to be able to target those units over some of the terrain blocking features. #2 A clear Plains terrain. In this situation nothing is going to block your LOS so you can shoot the Enemy from turn 1 with impunity. #3 Have a Hill top placement. If you have a Hill in your deployment Zone or can get the Ballista to the top of a hill terrain in, AT MOST, two turns. Otherwise this Unit is wasted Time doing nothing. This unit Becomes nearly useless once Enemy Units are engaged and/or if the battle field is covered with LOS blocking terrain preventing you from firing more than half the battle.

Dwarven Battleaxemen
Tank: ***
Heavy Infantry: ***
Heavy damage: ***
Cost Efficiency: ***
Overall: ***

These Guys are almost the Axemen all over again but with a few disadvantages and very little added to make up for that. Again 12 HPs makes them able to Tank decently yet less so than the Axmen because of 1/3 instead of 2/3 defense. The slightly Higher Penetration on attacks and slightly higher morale does not make up for this loss and the 8 extra point cost., but since they are only 8 points more than the axemen, are decent enough to play next to your core Infantry for pinches, but only if you have the Points left over to upgrade them. Given a Choice, between axemen and BattleAxemen, take the Axemen first.



Dwarven Bowmen
Fire Support: ***
Cost Efficiency: ****
Overall: ***/*

Bowmen get chaffed and belittled in all factions by many a player, I say you either Don’t understand what archers are supposed to do or your just not using them right anyway.
Bowmen should rarely be put in a situation where they will be engaged early on. They should sit behind your main line or back in your deployment zone lending fire aid to your melee. Never leave them Undefended, though, if your enemy has fast moving Units than can swing in around your backside to wipe them out. Targets for bowmen should be Light cavalry, Large and colossal Units and Firing into Melees. There is No better way to cause your Enemy to burn out defensive cards than to set 2 Archers firing in support of a melee engagement. HE Either spends cards defending the unit or Takes an extra point or 2 of damage each of your turns on that unit, Points of damage which may help guarantee a route check that turn. You should Never poopooh the Bowmen’s ability to wear a Large and colossal unit down. That +1 or +2 to hit will guarantee you do them some damage.

Dwarven Crossbowmen
Tank: ***
Heavy Infantry: ****
Heavy damage: ***
Fire Support: ***
Cost Efficiency: *****
Overall: ***/*

I bemoan the Fact that these guys are Not core units(which is most likely precisely why they are not. Archers? You got them. Tank? It can do it. Damage? Just as good as Axmen. If I could Fill a 1500 point army with 4 of these I would, sadly My core needs prevent it. But at the Cost these guys are versatile enough to fill all your Niches. Set them in your Front line and Shoot as you advance or just sit and shoot as your Enemy advances. Their chances to damage are only diminished 1 die less than standard bowmen, but once engaged, they are just as Good as Any infantry unit. Sporting the Same Hit points Attack and defense values as the Axemen for only 15 more points these guys are a bargain. I will have at least 1 of these guys in any 1500 point army I build and more as the point values go up.

Dwarven Hammermen
Tank: ***
Heavy Infantry: ***
Heavy Damage: ****
Cost Efficiency: ****
Overall: ***/*

The Debate currently rages, Long beards or Hammer men. Truth is, these two units have differing purposes. Both units can tank just as ANY Dwarven unit can with their 1/3 defense and 12 HPs. Having a 13 morale helps here also. But these Guys are your Unit smashers. Whether they engage head on or rush into another melee from the side(I prefer the latter use) to create a pinch, these guys are bound to Destroy enemy Units. Perhaps a mistake was made, yes, when handing out Elite tags and Totaling up Point costs as these guys are truly useful for their Point value being so low. If your panning an offensive maneuver army, this is the central pivot unit you want in your line.

Dwarven Militia
Tank: ***
Light Infantry: ***
Heavy Damage: **
Cost Efficiency: ****
Overall: ***

The Peasants of the dwarves, yet don’t be fooled by that moniker. These guys are Cheap but extremely useful in an offensive or defensive stance. Due to their Decent defense stats 2/2 and the typical 12 HPs.. these guys can stand an assault for several turns holding back an enemy until the big hammers arrive. They aren’t going to do a lot of damage most of the time, but they got spunk and at their cost you can have a decent Number of them in your line.

Dwarven Miners
Tank: **
Light Infantry: **
Heavy damage: ***
Cost Efficiency: ***
Overall: **/*

Like the Militia, these guys may be a bit tougher than their point cost would suggest. Not as tough as the Militia though with a 1 /2 Defense, they are not going to stand as long as the militia. Also with one fewer attack dice, they are not as likely to hit EVEn though when they do hit they are nearly guaranteed to do some damage with a 7 penetration. A couple of militia supported by a Miner unit can make a Decent Cheap offensive line. These guys are definitely not worth the cost on a defensive line given other choices for slightly higher cost.

Dwarven Spearmen
Tank: ****
Heavy Infantry: ****
Heavy Damage: ****
Cost Efficiency: ***
Overall: ****

Spearmen are you main line defensive unit and Cavalry busters. Take these guysfor sure when building a defensive line or when you know your enemy will have Cavalry and/or larger/colossal creatures. Unless you’re going to be using standing Hold orders or going up against large/colossal units, though, I would take another cheaper unit like crossbowmen, Hammer men or Axmen for your line.

Longbeards
Tank: ****
Heavy Infantry: ****
Heavy Damage:***
Cost Efficiency: ***
Overall: ***/*

Back to the Hammermen vs. Longbeards Debate. The Longbeards are Elite and have a hefty cost, But this Unit will stand it’s ground better than Any other Dwarven unit. It’s 14 Morale makes it hard to route, 1?4 defense makes it hard to do damage to So it is going to sit there a long time in a 1 on one fight and deal out damage. This is your CORE defensive unit in 2000+ point armies. It isn’t worth the cost in lesser point values, but place this unit in the center of a defensive line, set him up to take the enemies toughest face to face, especially their large/colossal/Fearsome creatures, and he will hold them while you move other units into support or Have your bowmen Fire into their melee wearing them down while they fail uselessly a him. Longbeards, when used Right, are true tanks with teeth.

Shortbeards
Tank: **
Heavy Infantry: ***
Heavy Damage: **
Cost Efficiency: ***
Overall: **/*

Now we come to the “Runts” of the Dwarven army. Shortbeards are (IMO) Point fillers. You got a spare 107+ points you can’t find a decent place to put in Upgrades of other units? Buy a shortbeard and you won’t be embarrassed by it. I would rather buy a Shotbeard for 107 points than Upgrade several units because it is still a tough unit and gives you 1 extra Unit to use for pinches. If I only had 80 to 90 points left, I wouldn’t be willing to down grade any units to take this though.
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Re: Dwarves of Runegard Units and Tactics
« Reply #1 on: Yesterday at 19:20:10 »
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Now I will cover the Dwarves Army abilities.

Sprint: This is mostly to expensive to use very often on any unit. 1 Command poiint for an extra inch of movement does not compare to puting a rune on a unit, taking a card or changing an order. This should Only be used in two very similiar situations.

#1 to get a Unit into a Finale rush position in the next turn, thus avoiding another rounds delay of melee combat.

#2 as a Surprise maneuver to bring a Unit out of a "hole" into a better striking position.

Otherwise this ability is best used very rarely.

Rune abiltity to gain an Extra Die of attacks Until the unit is routed.

This one is easy. Your a Fool if you don't place it on your Melee Dwarves at the soonest opportunity.
a nearly permenant extra dice of attacks is MORE than worth the Loss of a command card.
« Last Edit: January 25, 2015, 03:50:58 PM by BubblePig »

RushAss

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Re: Repost: Dwarf Units and Tactics
« Reply #1 on: March 04, 2009, 03:15:03 PM »
Rune abiltity to gain an Extra Die of attacks Until the unit is routed.

This one is easy. Your a Fool if you don't place it on your Melee Dwarves at the soonest opportunity.
a nearly permenant extra dice of attacks is MORE than worth the Loss of a command card.
I agree in most circumstances.  The Rune is best used on units that you expect to deliver the big damage.  I'll put it on Longbeards, Battle Axemen and Spearmen in a heartbeat.  But I won't rush to put it on Militia or Shortbeards unless I have extra command actions to burn.  It also depends upon the job you want the unit to do.  If you don't really need the extra die, don't waste the CA.

I'll give you an example:
One thing I sometimes like to do is place a unit of Milita at the end of my line and back it up with Antonians.  The Militia are not there to really hurt anybody, they are there to tie up a line unit and hang in there for a turn so that the Antonians can swing around and smash them.  Placing the Rune may be helpful once the pinch is achieved, but it may be overkill at that point.  Besides, I only expect to be hitting on 1s and 2s anyways and would prefer to apply the rune to the guys in the middle of the line who could really benefit from it.
"Art as expression, not as market campaigns
Will still capture our imaginations"
-Rush, Natural Science

Niko White

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Re: Repost: Dwarf Units and Tactics
« Reply #2 on: March 04, 2009, 08:01:44 PM »
I agree in most circumstances.  The Rune is best used on units that you expect to deliver the big damage.  I'll put it on Longbeards, Battle Axemen and Spearmen in a heartbeat.  But I won't rush to put it on Militia or Shortbeards unless I have extra command actions to burn.  It also depends upon the job you want the unit to do.  If you don't really need the extra die, don't waste the CA.

I'll give you an example:
One thing I sometimes like to do is place a unit of Milita at the end of my line and back it up with Antonians.  The Militia are not there to really hurt anybody, they are there to tie up a line unit and hang in there for a turn so that the Antonians can swing around and smash them.  Placing the Rune may be helpful once the pinch is achieved, but it may be overkill at that point.  Besides, I only expect to be hitting on 1s and 2s anyways and would prefer to apply the rune to the guys in the middle of the line who could really benefit from it.

This man speaks wisdom you would be wise to heed.

Always remember the roles you have in mind for your units, and don't waste command actions trying to get the out of role.

Chad_YMG

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Re: Repost: Dwarf Units and Tactics
« Reply #3 on: March 05, 2009, 06:29:39 AM »
In-house games of Battleground with the Dwarves are interesting by comparison.  Darwin tends to use Uruz heavily; it's not at all uncommon for his entire line to be marked before combat begins.  I use it far less often, sometimes on only one or two units.  It could be that one of us is completely wrong, but I suspect that we actually did a pretty good job of costing the ability.

In terms of straight-up points, Uruz is a good value.  An Axemen with 6 attacks is worth 29 more points than an Axemen with 5 attacks, and a Command Card is generally worth significantly less, so why wouldn't you follow Darwin's path?  As Niko said, it comes down to the role each unit is supposed to play.

Let's take a dramatic example -- a mirror match in which each side has a unit of Battleaxemen and a unit of Shortbeards.  The four units have met in combat, with the Battleaxemen each engaged with the enemy Shortbeard.

This fight is almost certainly going to come down to which Battleaxemen wins first.  Yes, a very lucky Shortbeard could win but what you're really looking for is to kill the enemy Shortbeard before yours dies/routs so you can pinch and obliterate the other Battleaxemen.

In this case, Rune of Uruz is a waste -- not because it's technically bad value on a Shortbeard, but because the Shortbeard's role is "not dying" rather than "killing".  That command action will be much better as a card -- a defensive one to keep the Shortbeard alive or an offensive one to help the Battleaxeman finish his job quickly.
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lazyj

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Re: Repost: Dwarf Units and Tactics
« Reply #4 on: June 01, 2009, 11:31:46 AM »
The Dwarves get no love when it comes to forum discussion. 3 responses to this awesome tactics post? I think it's because the two words that sum up the Dwarves are "solid" and "tough". Maybe folk look at them, think "hey, I know how to play these guys" and don't need to discuss it much? I guess?

Here's an easy one for someone to clarify for me: Do the Antonians pay MC penalties for hill terrain? I don't think they do, which is yet another reason to name them top cavalry unit. But before I get burned I want to make sure.

Niko White

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Re: Repost: Dwarf Units and Tactics
« Reply #5 on: June 01, 2009, 11:58:52 AM »
The Dwarves get no love when it comes to forum discussion. 3 responses to this awesome tactics post? I think it's because the two words that sum up the Dwarves are "solid" and "tough". Maybe folk look at them, think "hey, I know how to play these guys" and don't need to discuss it much? I guess?

Here's an easy one for someone to clarify for me: Do the Antonians pay MC penalties for hill terrain? I don't think they do, which is yet another reason to name them top cavalry unit. But before I get burned I want to make sure.

They don't, indeed.  I always like to think they live in the rolling foothills around Dwarf-held mountains.

Anyway I agree; it is way more obvious how to play Dwarves than how to play, say, Ravenwood or High Elves, so I think despite being a cool faction, people tend to not want to discuss them as much.

GoIndy

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Re: Repost: Dwarf Units and Tactics
« Reply #6 on: June 01, 2009, 12:17:42 PM »
Dwarves have one of my favorite core units....Dwarven Militia!!

I really, really, really, like the Dwarves.  As a matter of fact, with the changes to range units and making them weaker, I think Dwarves might be too good.  My rationale is thus....Dwarves are sturdy as heck, and across the board solid.  The make up for that sturdiness by moving really slow.  However, if no range weapons, of ineffective range weapons, then the slow speed doesn't hurt them near as much since they don't pay for their slowness.

Regardless, I never field the Dwarves "clean", I always have some mercs.  Everyone in my group knows I'm a believer in healer mages, and the Dwarf army in my mind is perfect for them.  However, I've been known to toss in a Hydra, Dragon, Golem, and anything else I can get my hands on in there to go with my sturdy Dwarven line.

Just for fun, the kind of army I typically toss together is like....
4 x Dwarven Militia
1 Red Dragon
1 Antonion Horseman
1 Stone Golem

Ok...maybe that isn't typical, but I have used that army, laugh.

 


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Re: Repost: Dwarf Units and Tactics
« Reply #7 on: June 01, 2009, 02:34:01 PM »
Tim and I had that conversation about the Dwarves being too good.  I feel that point for point, the Dwarves are better than just about anybody once they are engaged, but the overall slowness leads to them being out-maneuvered and that's the drawback.  That issue was really clarified to me in the few games I've used them in conjunction with terrain as any negative terrain effects magnify their sluggishness.  Aside from that, they DO final rush and route as quickly as most other infantry units so they are not a lost cause maneuver-wise.  And if you're desperate, you can always sprint a couple of the little buggers.  One other disadvantage that most seem to miss is that even their nastiest units have only 4 green health boxes as opposed to the 5 green health sported by many of the heavy hitters of other factions.  Umenzi Chosen and Worthy, Lizardmen Tyrants, Hawk Greatswordsmen and Heavy Infantry (and even Spears, Swords and pikes!) all have that 5th green hit.  This is somewhat mitigated by the Rune of Uruz as long as they make that first courage check, though.

In my keeping with the believe that a faction is normally only as good as it's core units, the Dwarves are really solid.  Axemen, Battle Axemen and Spearmen are really tough guys that are a great value for the mid-200 point range.  As Tim pointed out, Militia are incredible tanks for the 157 points.  You can construct an army out of just these guys and it would be pretty competitive against anybody except Elves.

A big factor of Dwarven play is in how you set your troops up since you're probably going to be out maneuvered anyways.  Making sure you get the best match ups when you deploy is more important with Dwarves than anybody else.  You don't have Maneuver Mastery or Lash to cover your butt or take advantage of an opponent's movement errors.  Your guys eat precious command actions if you need to sprint them.  And since your units are somewhat expensive, it's not likely that you'll have a deep line.  Each unit has got to count and you need to make sure you've placed them somewhere that they will do so.

Application of the Rune is another big thing.  You'll be tempted to place the Rune on every available line unit.  Sometimes that's not a bad idea, but you should first place the rune on the Units that will have a higher likelihood of generating more damage with it.  Runes on Longbeards are a must against just about anybody.  Runes on Shortbeards - not so much.  If you have a Militia unit who's job is just to hang in there until it gets some help, you may want to spend your command actions elsewhere as (6) 4/5 is not much better than (5) 4/5.  Unless it's engaged with a swarm of rats or something equally abysmal.
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Will still capture our imaginations"
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Quelmotz

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Re: Repost: Dwarf Units and Tactics
« Reply #8 on: June 01, 2009, 09:46:34 PM »
Really interesting tips and hints  :)

I'm planning on getting the Dwarves of RUNEGARD earlier than I planned this year, so look forward to see some session reports in which the High Elves get chopped, smashed, bludgeoned and get totally destroyed... Muahahahahahaha  :D Oh crap, forgot about maneuver mastery...  >:(

"I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones." - Albert Einstein

Niko White

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Re: Repost: Dwarf Units and Tactics
« Reply #9 on: June 01, 2009, 09:52:36 PM »
Really interesting tips and hints  :)

I'm planning on getting the Dwarves of RUNEGARD earlier than I planned this year, so look forward to see some session reports in which the High Elves get chopped, smashed, bludgeoned and get totally destroyed... Muahahahahahaha  :D Oh crap, forgot about maneuver mastery...  >:(



FYI, as a High Elf general, one of the things I hate to see most on the other side of the table are Antonian Horsemen.  Fast, impossible to shoot, and hard hitting, pretty much a nightmare for High Elves.  They even have 6 skill!

Quelmotz

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Re: Repost: Dwarf Units and Tactics
« Reply #10 on: June 01, 2009, 10:18:51 PM »
Really interesting tips and hints  :)

I'm planning on getting the Dwarves of RUNEGARD earlier than I planned this year, so look forward to see some session reports in which the High Elves get chopped, smashed, bludgeoned and get totally destroyed... Muahahahahahaha  :D Oh crap, forgot about maneuver mastery...  >:(



FYI, as a High Elf general, one of the things I hate to see most on the other side of the table are Antonian Horsemen.  Fast, impossible to shoot, and hard hitting, pretty much a nightmare for High Elves.  They even have 6 skill!

Muahahahaha. I'll take your advice and field 2-3 of them. From Rush's opinion, they're
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Niko White

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Re: Repost: Dwarf Units and Tactics
« Reply #11 on: June 01, 2009, 10:20:20 PM »
Muahahahaha. I'll take your advice and field 2-3 of them.

Well, they're Elite, but 1-2 go a long way, they have a brutal threat range to ward off Bowriders and the like.

Quelmotz

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Re: Repost: Dwarf Units and Tactics
« Reply #12 on: June 01, 2009, 10:33:10 PM »
To continue what I was saying...

"Forget about gold, these guys (the antonian horsemen) are worth their weight in platinum!" -RushAss
"I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones." - Albert Einstein

RushAss

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Re: Repost: Dwarf Units and Tactics
« Reply #13 on: June 02, 2009, 09:33:58 AM »
To continue what I was saying...

"Forget about gold, these guys (the antonian horsemen) are worth their weight in platinum!" -RushAss
To be fair, those Antonians benefited from some lousy attack dice on my opponent's end that game.  But yeah, they are a snappy little unit and if you can flank somebody with them, they HURT!  They have never let me down as long as I used them properly.  Which is to have them lurk behind an average unit at the end of your line and then ram into the sucker that engages that average unit.  I actually like to put Militia on the flank because they can usually hold up an enemy unit long enough for the Antonians to do their thing.
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Will still capture our imaginations"
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Quelmotz

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Re: Repost: Dwarf Units and Tactics
« Reply #14 on: June 02, 2009, 09:00:13 PM »
To continue what I was saying...

"Forget about gold, these guys (the antonian horsemen) are worth their weight in platinum!" -RushAss
To be fair, those Antonians benefited from some lousy attack dice on my opponent's end that game.  But yeah, they are a snappy little unit and if you can flank somebody with them, they HURT!  They have never let me down as long as I used them properly.  Which is to have them lurk behind an average unit at the end of your line and then ram into the sucker that engages that average unit.  I actually like to put Militia on the flank because they can usually hold up an enemy unit long enough for the Antonians to do their thing.

Yeah, but they're still (arguably) the best LIGHT cavalry unit in the game. (centaurs aren't "light" cavalry, I think)
"I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones." - Albert Einstein