Author Topic: Trolls suggestion  (Read 276 times)

themanfromsaturn

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Trolls suggestion
« on: July 15, 2021, 01:25:04 AM »
The troll’s hitboxes should be half green & half yellow, not half green and half red. The troll shouldn’t have to make a courage check every time it takes a hit once its buddy falls. It makes sense mechanically and thematically. It’s a big, angry, semi-sentient beast that regenerates. It shouldn’t be a coward.

I like the vomit ability. That’s a nice touch. I’d also like it if they could throw boulders.

YMG Corey

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Re: Trolls suggestion
« Reply #1 on: July 15, 2021, 07:15:54 PM »
That's an interesting idea.  It's a major improvement in their fighting ability, as they functionally only take one test the entire game.  Maybe it would need to be paired with a reduction in Courage?

I can actually see the logic behind taking a test every turn:  Trolls are animalistic; when one dies and the enemy start swarming the other one, it becomes overwhelmed.  Maybe we should consider keeping the Red boxes, but upping their Courage to 14?

Duane_Nordeen

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Re: Trolls suggestion
« Reply #2 on: July 23, 2021, 04:41:02 PM »
I'm not for this idea.  It would make the Trolls (A popular and powerful unit) more powerful and doesn't seem to fit the Orc 2.0 army concept of fragile morale.

The Troll is already popular.  If it's usually on the field, does it need a Yellow Box upgrade and 1 rout check instead of almost infinite checks with Regeneration?  There's an idea that routing actually helps the troll since it can regenerate.

Trolls are already tough units, do they really need to have only 1 rout check per game?  Does a powerful unit that rarely routs fit with the Orc 2.0 army?

Does a single rout check need to be combined with regeneration?  The trolls pass that 1 rout check and must now be killed completely while also regenerating to avoid being killed.

What precedence does this set?  Do the other Green/Red units change also?  Should Lizardmen Ancients and Skeleton Trolls gain this same thing?  What effect would Green/Yellow Ancients have on the game?  This argument IMHO works way better with the Lizardmen Ancients who are elderly, experienced Lizardmen.

Against armies that focus on breaking the enemy's morale such as Undead, this change could be a game breaker especially if other Green/Red units are changed.  Potentially, players would refuse to play armies such as undead since the Green/Red units are virtually unroutable as Green/Yellow units.

Once this single rout check is passed...where's the stress and worry?  The Trolls are here to stay for the rest of the game.  No need to have a reserve or backup plan. No need to plan to adjust or recover.  By the time the Trolls finally die, the battle is in the end game.

How much extra damage will enemy armies take because the Troll's don't rout?  Is it fair for that damage to be virtually guaranteed?

If we start messing around with the command cards so this single check can't be adjusted, are we putting too much effort and complexity into something that isn't really needed since the Trolls are already a popular unit?

If the Troll's courage is lowered to make that single rout check harder, what effect does that have against Warriors of the Mist, Banshees, etc?  Should those units be the "rock" to the troll "scissor"?  Should the powerful troll be so weak against incorporeal units?

What about the other low courage weaknesses inherent in the game?  Does it make sense for the Troll to have those weaknesses? 

If it makes sense for the Troll to have these low courage weaknesses, doesn't that invalidate the original thought that the Troll "shouldn't be a coward"?


YMG Corey

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Re: Trolls suggestion
« Reply #3 on: August 10, 2021, 01:13:53 PM »
The Troll is already popular.  If it's usually on the field, does it need a Yellow Box upgrade and 1 rout check instead of almost infinite checks with Regeneration?  There's an idea that routing actually helps the troll since it can regenerate.

Trolls are popular, but I don't know that they show up on the table much.  A lot of people take them initially because they want to play them...but then end up putting them back in the box.

That said, we have the same concerns about "1 rout check and then they're fearless" being too much of a swing the other way.  I don't think that idea is going to make it through the design process.